Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

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markwinn73
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 10:39 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by markwinn73 »

Refuse to sign anything unless you are 100% sure about what you are signing.
If it’s to do with leaving too early in a morning due to not doing checks long enough, ask to see the company policy on this (in writing) as I know the DVSA terminology is “sufficient time for that particular vehicle” as a car would take less time than an artic with crane attached.
If it’s to do with end of shift, tell them to jog on, what time you leave the yard after you have finished is your choice unless they are paying you to stay until a set time.
markwinn73
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 10:39 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by markwinn73 »

Also, any company that are looking to action disciplinary action for leaving 1-2 minutes early are nit picking and sounds like they are going to be going after everything else you do wrong to find a reason to let some drivers go.
kalFlashy
Posts: 22
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 10:44 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by kalFlashy »

Pull him through his little office window. He'll see things differently then. 👊
JasOnline
Posts: 6
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 10:57 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by JasOnline »

That’s ridiculous. I personally would sign NOT SIGNING IT!
darrZero
Posts: 9
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 10:21 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by darrZero »

Sounds like they are planning you for a full shift and to start at a certain time to fit it all in. But your starting early which is probably not leaving enough time later in the day for the other jobs.
NeedLex
Posts: 12
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 10:23 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by NeedLex »

Before anyone can give you good advice, you need to give more information on when you left too early. Are you not doing daily checks for long enough, or leaving at the end of the shift?
AllTruck
Posts: 9
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 10:36 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by AllTruck »

NeedLex wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:24 am Before anyone can give you good advice, you need to give more information on when you left too early. Are you not doing daily checks for long enough, or leaving at the end of the shift?
how long is long enough for vehicle checks?
NeedLex
Posts: 12
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 10:23 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by NeedLex »

AllTruck wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:24 am
NeedLex wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:24 am Before anyone can give you good advice, you need to give more information on when you left too early. Are you not doing daily checks for long enough, or leaving at the end of the shift?
how long is long enough for vehicle checks?
long enough to ensure that the vehicle is roadworthy. DVSA reckon 15 mins. I've always showed between 10-15 mins, but that might be longer if you end up having to re strap load or kick out skinnies in France. Never had a problem when DVSA have pulled me and downloaded card, so I would say anything over 10 mins should cover it. But, unless you are brand new to the game you already know it and are just on a fishing trip. 🤣👍
AllTruck
Posts: 9
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 10:36 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by AllTruck »

NeedLex wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:24 am
AllTruck wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:24 am
NeedLex wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:24 am Before anyone can give you good advice, you need to give more information on when you left too early. Are you not doing daily checks for long enough, or leaving at the end of the shift?
how long is long enough for vehicle checks?
long enough to ensure that the vehicle is roadworthy. DVSA reckon 15 mins. I've always showed between 10-15 mins, but that might be longer if you end up having to re strap load or kick out skinnies in France. Never had a problem when DVSA have pulled me and downloaded card, so I would say anything over 10 mins should cover it. But, unless you are brand new to the game you already know it and are just on a fishing trip. 🤣👍
DVSA don't care how long you take to do vehicle checks, as long as you show a reasonable amount of time.
NeedLex
Posts: 12
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 10:23 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by NeedLex »

AllTruck wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:25 am
NeedLex wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:24 am
AllTruck wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:24 am

how long is long enough for vehicle checks?
long enough to ensure that the vehicle is roadworthy. DVSA reckon 15 mins. I've always showed between 10-15 mins, but that might be longer if you end up having to re strap load or kick out skinnies in France. Never had a problem when DVSA have pulled me and downloaded card, so I would say anything over 10 mins should cover it. But, unless you are brand new to the game you already know it and are just on a fishing trip. 🤣👍
DVSA don't care how long you take to do vehicle checks, as long as you show a reasonable amount of time.
as I said, "long enough to ensure vehicle is roadworthy". You try doing 2 mins and driving. You get pulled and they find something wrong, they will be bothered about the time, or lack of it. It's not my wallet that will suffer. 🤣
orrzmancy
Posts: 6
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:07 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by orrzmancy »

Legally. You should be suspended with pay with investigation pending. The evidence should be presented to you for disciplinary action / date. You must be asked to take a union rep or fellow employee in with you. This ( the company policy) should be in your contract and or employee handbook
DonMower
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:12 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by DonMower »

Have a lay in tomorrow and get in hr late. See what they say then 🤣🤣
HollRida
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 10:30 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by HollRida »

DonMower wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:29 am Have a lay in tomorrow and get in hr late. See what they say then 🤣🤣
pretty sure it would be "here's your P45 f**k off" 🤣
picBuzzo
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:15 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by picBuzzo »

He can give you a disciplinary for historical things. But it has to be done properly. Saying here sign this is not on. You must be invited to an impartial fact finding investigation meeting then a disciplinary hearing.
lesPower
Posts: 16
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 10:44 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by lesPower »

crayalix10 wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:43 am Not Royal Mail by any chance?
RM say should not leave until 20 mins have lapsed since your start time so shows you have done sufficient checks.
crayalix10
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:20 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by crayalix10 »

lesPower wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:45 am
crayalix10 wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:43 am Not Royal Mail by any chance?
RM say should not leave until 20 mins have lapsed since your start time so shows you have done sufficient checks.
yeah I know 👍🏻 I was wondering if a gaffer is trying to pull him up on leaving earlier than the 20mins.
SimoXmc
Posts: 13
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 10:52 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by SimoXmc »

In short no, they should have raised the issue with you at the time. Just them saying something happened, doesn't mean it happened. They should have spoken with you about it at the time and had you sign something then. Then when it happens on multiple occasions they have the things you signed at the time as a record of these thing’s actually happening. Otherwise they could just say anything they wanted anytime they wanted. Get a union rep in
ManGrand
Posts: 11
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:22 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by ManGrand »

What exactly do you mean by left too early??
gareExtra
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 10:55 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by gareExtra »

ManGrand wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:54 am What exactly do you mean by left too early??
my guess is he's writing on his time sheet he's finished at 17:00 but he's actually leaving the yard at 16:40. Or something like that
ManGrand
Posts: 11
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:22 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by ManGrand »

gareExtra wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:55 am
ManGrand wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 10:54 am What exactly do you mean by left too early??
my guess is he's writing on his time sheet he's finished at 17:00 but he's actually leaving the yard at 16:40. Or something like that
without actually knowing that, I don't understand everyone's comments 🤷🏼‍♂️
AmbBrood
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 10:57 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by AmbBrood »

First step should normally be verbal warning depends on how severe your actions have been
billcopy77
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 10:58 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by billcopy77 »

You in a union? Sure they could use some toilet paper
VargRaw
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 11:00 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by VargRaw »

I worked for a company where I would be praised for this. 🤣
timcquest55
Posts: 7
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:24 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by timcquest55 »

Would that be constructive dismissal?
gaviHood
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 11:03 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by gaviHood »

timcquest55 wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 11:02 am Would that be constructive dismissal?
no constructive dismissal is when an employer makes your life ,job so difficult u have to leave but it is a hard one to prove have to keep lots of dates and info so on
FerrRee
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 11:05 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by FerrRee »

Is it leaving too early as I’m not taking long enough for vehicle checks; or is there a condition attached to the companies O licence that prohibits at what time vehicles can enter / leave the depot? If it’s the first they have to prove you have failed to do. A comprehensive vehicle check as the time required is “recommended” time to complete check (around 10 to 15 mins), if it’s the latter then it’s more serious as action could be taken against the operators licence which could put the operation at risk, so they may be covering their ar5e5 by issuing the warning as a way of demonstrating they are taking action if they were to be reported for allowing vehicle movements outside of permitted times 🤷
AntDaily
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:27 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by AntDaily »

FerrRee wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 11:05 am Is it leaving too early as I’m not taking long enough for vehicle checks; or is there a condition attached to the companies O licence that prohibits at what time vehicles can enter / leave the depot? If it’s the first they have to prove you have failed to do. A comprehensive vehicle check as the time required is “recommended” time to complete check (around 10 to 15 mins), if it’s the latter then it’s more serious as action could be taken against the operators licence which could put the operation at risk, so they may be covering their ar5e5 by issuing the warning as a way of demonstrating they are taking action if they were to be reported for allowing vehicle movements outside of permitted times 🤷
best accurate answer I seen to this question 👍🏻
FerrRee
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 11:05 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by FerrRee »

AntDaily wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 11:06 am
FerrRee wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 11:05 am Is it leaving too early as I’m not taking long enough for vehicle checks; or is there a condition attached to the companies O licence that prohibits at what time vehicles can enter / leave the depot? If it’s the first they have to prove you have failed to do. A comprehensive vehicle check as the time required is “recommended” time to complete check (around 10 to 15 mins), if it’s the latter then it’s more serious as action could be taken against the operators licence which could put the operation at risk, so they may be covering their ar5e5 by issuing the warning as a way of demonstrating they are taking action if they were to be reported for allowing vehicle movements outside of permitted times 🤷
best accurate answer I seen to this question 👍🏻
thanks
cartDark02
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 11:08 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by cartDark02 »

maybe the yard has a curfew and drivers cant start before a certain time, maybe something completely different lol
PatNaybor
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 11:09 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by PatNaybor »

Don't sign it should be a hearing with evidence and facts of what has been done wrong
mitShcam
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:30 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by mitShcam »

Not sure on your yard rules but if your leaving too early just do what your supposed to. Have they called you up on this before? Have you been given a verbal warning before?
BranGino
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:32 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by BranGino »

He cannot issue you a written warning without a thorough investigation. You also have a right for representation during a hearing which you should have. He also cannot be pre-judice which he has done by issuing a straight written warning. He has already done it illegally so it is null and void anyway. I have done 100's of these in my previous job and dealt with many union reps. If I was you I would report it and fight it but get a new job pronto.
alanNotice
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:35 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by alanNotice »

kallAdvice wrote: Sun May 07, 2023 11:14 am sound familiar 🤣
oh the good times 🤣
CharScree
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:37 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by CharScree »

Sounds like a prison sentence to me..
Sack that off..
vidCrown
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:39 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by vidCrown »

Probably contravening operators licence regulations nothing to do with driving regs
KrisSupreme
Posts: 6
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:42 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by KrisSupreme »

Everyone mentions tacho 28 days etc but I’m not reading it as infringement’s
I have been a manager and done disciplinary etc, if an employer has an issue with you leaving early then they should in the first instance mention to you informally to start with telling you not to do it. If you ignore it then they should let you know formally in writing if you continue to finish early then it could result in disciplinary action. Next stage if you ignore it would be invite you to a meeting to discuss etc and ask if there’s an underlying issue eg wife ill that you need to go to or yourself etc, pending outcome of meeting it could be verbal or written warning.
Refuse to sign and put your reasons in writing to your manager and HR if you have and say no investigatory meeting took place (employment law) with no opportunity for you to put case forward, if an employer doesn’t pick you up on a practice they don’t like then in the eyes of employment law it becomes an acceptable action. If they are playing dirty then put it in your letter that someone else (name them) does it because again they would have to do the same treatment to them, can’t treat staff differently (again law)
peteChatty
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:44 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by peteChatty »

Of course they can. It only takes 25 unexplained absences to sack someone.. you tell them when you sack them that it’s been 25 times and say goodbye..
alisCoops
Posts: 12
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 11:20 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by alisCoops »

Need a verbal warning before written one. Call ACAS and they will advise.
TimGoofy
Posts: 18
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 11:25 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by TimGoofy »

You should of had a verbal warning first, unless it’s gross misconduct or dangerous, fraud can classed as instant dismal, that can be something as simple as starting and finishing working at different time that clocking in card or even your tachometer says.
RussFerdy
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 12:00 pm

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by RussFerdy »

A written warning for benefitting the company 😂😂😂 tell them f**k off n look for something different and then when you leave take the fuckers for constructive dismissal
findMon
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:48 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by findMon »

How can you be leaving too early? You’re the driver you know your route you know what times you need to leave 🤷‍♂️ or is it finishing early?
BalSteen
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:56 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by BalSteen »

I had a warning recently never treated the same after so I handed me notice in leave Friday
thollerer41
Posts: 12
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 9:39 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by thollerer41 »

They have failed the formal disciplinary process, and if they sack you you’d be automatically entitled to unfair dismissal. Correct process is: Investigation, full paid suspension (if required), written communication inviting you to a hearing, meeting in person, and then an appeal if required.
You need to be informed of the basis for the complaint before a hearing for them to give you a formal warning. DO NOT SIGN IT!
WhiMore
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 11:32 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by WhiMore »

Sign nothing. And kiss my ass. If you don't like it find another driver. Plenty of work out there
colibbie22
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 11:34 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by colibbie22 »

Check your own company's disciplinary procedure. There is a template they should follow however some companies will differ slightly from it whilst still following it.
woodiner30
Posts: 4
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 11:58 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by woodiner30 »

Too early?? What sort of a fucked up crock of pish clusterfuck is that?? Never heard so much bollocks in all my life! Id have told the t**t**ffle to shove their bullsh*t warning up there arsehole... sounds to me like they want you out anyway, so you may as well go on your own terms in a blaze of glory!
geelton89
Posts: 21
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 12:08 pm

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by geelton89 »

I had the same thing a few years ago I told them I won't sign anything and for them to present me with finding of the investigation and a date and I'll bring in the union rep. They dropped it instantly and never heard anything afterwards. Don't be bullied by them tell them straight and they will back down when they see you won't take sh*t from them
EllPurfect
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 12:10 pm

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by EllPurfect »

lots asking for clarification on the circumstances and not one single reply from the OP!!! Sounds like bull sh*t! Otherwise known as attention seeking!
FreeRappa
Posts: 9
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 11:42 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by FreeRappa »

In short no. Procedures need to be followed, that isn’t following any of them.
StevChrono
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 11:46 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by StevChrono »

Tell him go f**k him self better be early than late
FreNetwork
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 1:39 pm

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by FreNetwork »

Tell him bollocks and don't sign. Time to move on
drewPong
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 11:49 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by drewPong »

Go in late and tell them you're making up for the times you're early
harllWorld
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 1:49 pm

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by harllWorld »

Do. Not. Sign. It!!!
There should have been an investigation and disciplinary hearing before he can issue a warning like that.
ClearBoot
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun May 07, 2023 11:52 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by ClearBoot »

Tell him no & look for another job, manager sounds like prize plum.
AndRotund
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 10:41 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by AndRotund »

It's a big company. Bunch of American nobbers.
I've left it to unite as there as pissed off as I am.
It will affect all the drivers not just me.
We were told 45 min checks a min of 30 min for rigids.
Don't go out the main gate until the 30 min mark. So I waited by the gate just to play the game.
Now there moving the goal posts and saying the wheels can't move until a min of 30 mins..
My argument what if fuel is required. Or something else.. they've been trying to bully and pester me into signing for it.
My response was not positive 😕.
AndRotund
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 10:41 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by AndRotund »

Don't worry all.
I've said my bit when I just got back.
As I'm sure you can all relate.
None lorry drivers as managers.
And kids to boot.
Doesn't matter you've been doing this over a decade..
Blame the driver. Sorry for the late comments I was driving.
jonarach08
Posts: 16
Joined: Sat May 06, 2023 9:24 am

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by jonarach08 »

After 5-10 minutes if checking I really don't see what else they expect you to find
marMorne88
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri May 05, 2023 1:09 pm

Re: Can an employer go back over months and years and find company issues like this. Then add them all together and give

Post by marMorne88 »

I agree sounds like someone's got it in for you. Unless you already had a disciplinary on file they should have notified you and give you a chance to correct the mistake.
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