My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

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NatRox
Posts: 17
Joined: Tue May 02, 2023 2:10 pm

My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by NatRox »

My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure would I use to report this to TC/DVLA?
Gazardille24
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2023 9:17 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by Gazardille24 »

An email to your case worker. There are no standard procedures or templates for this, only you know the full facts of the situation.
Are they still employed? If so, I'm wondering why, and I think the TC would too.
Which drug(s) did they test positive for? If it's one of the opiates did you allow a right of appeal for any action? Several legitimate medicines could give a positive result. If they tested positive for cannabis (most likely IMO) then you're better off without these guys.
NatRox
Posts: 17
Joined: Tue May 02, 2023 2:10 pm

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by NatRox »

Gazardille24 wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:11 pm An email to your case worker. There are no standard procedures or templates for this, only you know the full facts of the situation.
Are they still employed? If so, I'm wondering why, and I think the TC would too.
Which drug(s) did they test positive for? If it's one of the opiates did you allow a right of appeal for any action? Several legitimate medicines could give a positive result. If they tested positive for cannabis (most likely IMO) then you're better off without these guys.
going through investigation and disciplinary procedure now. Cocaine and cannabis. This was prior to shift starting.
Gazardille24
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2023 9:17 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by Gazardille24 »

NatRox wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:11 pm
Gazardille24 wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:11 pm An email to your case worker. There are no standard procedures or templates for this, only you know the full facts of the situation.
Are they still employed? If so, I'm wondering why, and I think the TC would too.
Which drug(s) did they test positive for? If it's one of the opiates did you allow a right of appeal for any action? Several legitimate medicines could give a positive result. If they tested positive for cannabis (most likely IMO) then you're better off without these guys.
going through investigation and disciplinary procedure now. Cocaine and cannabis. This was prior to shift starting.
Cannabis is detectable in the system for up to 28 days, so really it's the very worst drug of choice for drivers. Cocaine usually clears in 2 to 3 days depending on the type of test used.
Hair analysis obvious covers a much longer period of time - have you noticed how many drivers have shaved heads? 🤣
I'm not a prude about these things, but in our line of work we just can't take chances. I had one driver last year that was allegedly a regular cannabis user, I was very pleased when he left of his own accord for his own reasons before any testing was implemented.
MalGutsy
Posts: 25
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2023 9:06 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by MalGutsy »

I would have a read of articles 6, 7 and 13 of GDPR first to ensure that you have obtained proper consent and that consent includes that their data will be shared with you as an ETM and external authorities. Drug test data is classed as health data and is therefore considered highly sensitive. I would tread very carefully. Also, be aware that the drivers have the right to remove consent for further processing at any time and this would a prevent you. The only way you may be able to share without consent is under article 23 1(d). But to do this you would need to clearly demonstrate an obligation on the operator within UK legislation.
ianyssaha
Posts: 10
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2023 9:21 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by ianyssaha »

MalGutsy wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:12 pm I would have a read of articles 6, 7 and 13 of GDPR first to ensure that you have obtained proper consent and that consent includes that their data will be shared with you as an ETM and external authorities. Drug test data is classed as health data and is therefore considered highly sensitive. I would tread very carefully. Also, be aware that the drivers have the right to remove consent for further processing at any time and this would a prevent you. The only way you may be able to share without consent is under article 23 1(d). But to do this you would need to clearly demonstrate an obligation on the operator within UK legislation.
I think I remember a case where a driver was dismissed due to failing a random drugs test. I think the driver won a tribunal because of the dismissal.
simrytact
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2023 9:24 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by simrytact »

ianyssaha wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:13 pm
MalGutsy wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:12 pm I would have a read of articles 6, 7 and 13 of GDPR first to ensure that you have obtained proper consent and that consent includes that their data will be shared with you as an ETM and external authorities. Drug test data is classed as health data and is therefore considered highly sensitive. I would tread very carefully. Also, be aware that the drivers have the right to remove consent for further processing at any time and this would a prevent you. The only way you may be able to share without consent is under article 23 1(d). But to do this you would need to clearly demonstrate an obligation on the operator within UK legislation.
I think I remember a case where a driver was dismissed due to failing a random drugs test. I think the driver won a tribunal because of the dismissal.
https://www.crosslandsolicitors.com/sit ... drug-tests
That seems to be more about the disciplinary process being incorrectly / unfairly followed but it's worth a read as it raises some very good points.
Anddboxem
Posts: 12
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2023 9:26 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by Anddboxem »

Be careful
Depending on the test used a can of well known fizzy drink can give a positive reading, its something with all the sugars used in it
KarCanyons
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2023 9:26 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by KarCanyons »

DO NOT report that to the TC. You have no right to jeopardies their licence. They haven’t been convicted of any crime. That test is for internal workplace due diligence only. Also had the drivers been previously informed that you may share the results with outside bodies. If not then it would be breach of GDPR
jasSnoop
Posts: 10
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2023 9:29 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by jasSnoop »

KarCanyons wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:15 pm DO NOT report that to the TC. You have no right to jeopardies their licence. They haven’t been convicted of any crime. That test is for internal workplace due diligence only. Also had the drivers been previously informed that you may share the results with outside bodies. If not then it would be breach of GDPR
in what kind of a fucked up world do we live in when the person detecting drug use while in control of a metal killing machine is the one “jeopardizing their licence” rather than the person actually pumping the drug in to their own body? FFS.
You’re quite correct, they haven’t been convicted of any crime. However, Natalie has every right (and a duty of care) to report someone who is committing a crime to the relevant authorities to deal with.
Report. Get them off the road. Take their licences. I don’t want me, any of my family or my friends injured or killed by one of these idiots and “their right” not to have their “licenses jeopardized”. You, on the other hand, are welcome to continue in cloud cuckoo land and take the chance they don’t run over one of your family members. FFS.
KarCanyons
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2023 9:26 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by KarCanyons »

jasSnoop wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:16 pm
KarCanyons wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:15 pm DO NOT report that to the TC. You have no right to jeopardies their licence. They haven’t been convicted of any crime. That test is for internal workplace due diligence only. Also had the drivers been previously informed that you may share the results with outside bodies. If not then it would be breach of GDPR
in what kind of a fucked up world do we live in when the person detecting drug use while in control of a metal killing machine is the one “jeopardizing their licence” rather than the person actually pumping the drug in to their own body? FFS.
You’re quite correct, they haven’t been convicted of any crime. However, Natalie has every right (and a duty of care) to report someone who is committing a crime to the relevant authorities to deal with.
Report. Get them off the road. Take their licences. I don’t want me, any of my family or my friends injured or killed by one of these idiots and “their right” not to have their “licenses jeopardized”. You, on the other hand, are welcome to continue in cloud cuckoo land and take the chance they don’t run over one of your family members. FFS.
it’s an out of the box test ffs. Was it administered by a medical professional? Would it have any weight in a court of law?
Workplace drug testing is for due diligence only, it has no legal standing and you have no right to pass on the results to the TC.
The guy could’ve taken online CBD products and felt no I’ll effect and you think he should loose his licence?? Give your head a wobble pal it’s not a legally admirable test and definitely no right to inform the TC
NatRox
Posts: 17
Joined: Tue May 02, 2023 2:10 pm

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by NatRox »

KarCanyons wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:16 pm
jasSnoop wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:16 pm
KarCanyons wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:15 pm DO NOT report that to the TC. You have no right to jeopardies their licence. They haven’t been convicted of any crime. That test is for internal workplace due diligence only. Also had the drivers been previously informed that you may share the results with outside bodies. If not then it would be breach of GDPR
in what kind of a fucked up world do we live in when the person detecting drug use while in control of a metal killing machine is the one “jeopardizing their licence” rather than the person actually pumping the drug in to their own body? FFS.
You’re quite correct, they haven’t been convicted of any crime. However, Natalie has every right (and a duty of care) to report someone who is committing a crime to the relevant authorities to deal with.
Report. Get them off the road. Take their licences. I don’t want me, any of my family or my friends injured or killed by one of these idiots and “their right” not to have their “licenses jeopardized”. You, on the other hand, are welcome to continue in cloud cuckoo land and take the chance they don’t run over one of your family members. FFS.
it’s an out of the box test ffs. Was it administered by a medical professional? Would it have any weight in a court of law?
Workplace drug testing is for due diligence only, it has no legal standing and you have no right to pass on the results to the TC.
The guy could’ve taken online CBD products and felt no I’ll effect and you think he should loose his licence?? Give your head a wobble pal it’s not a legally admirable test and definitely no right to inform the TC
Thanks for all the responses, the moral side isn’t in question I was asking about the requirements as far as the TC or DVLA are concerned.
NatRox
Posts: 17
Joined: Tue May 02, 2023 2:10 pm

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by NatRox »

To be honest my thought was that other than the internal investigation there would not need to be any further action but always best to get another opinion.
panner41
Posts: 19
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2023 9:32 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by panner41 »

Stay clear of it all!!… Unless random drug testing is within their contract, unless a qualified sample practitioner has taken the sample and it’s been analyzed by an approved lab within the approved timescale the test result is useless
marQuant
Posts: 17
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2023 9:32 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by marQuant »

I agree with KarCanyons. By all means sack them, but not required to tell anyone else, unless you're feeling peevish.
HalDailies
Posts: 9
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2023 9:36 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by HalDailies »

Another good question and as ever each case will be dealt with on its own merits.
Referrals to the Traffic Commissioner would be through convictions only. So at this point there is no conviction simply an internal process. So suspension, followed by investigation (I would suggest swiftly) followed by dismissal. You don't automatically have to dismiss someone, that would depend on your policy.
Importance of having a clear and robust policy and HR processes. You will have all necessary documents and notes from the event for future reference but no requirement to report to TC.
KusThus
Posts: 15
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2023 9:34 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by KusThus »

Sacked and reported to Traffic Commissioner
youBuzz
Posts: 25
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2023 9:39 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by youBuzz »

Some interesting responses on here (as always). It’s great that you’re completing random drugs tests and hopefully you’ll have a policy that supports your process. There is no need to report to the TC based on what you’ve said. I would complete your internal investigation and decide on appropriate action (which may include dismissal).
lukKaven
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2023 9:41 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by lukKaven »

It is also very important to mention here that any results before disciplinary measures or dismissal should be checked with a recognized laboratory to back up the test. Cover your arse should an employee decide to go the tribunal route!
rohoneeth
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2023 2:55 pm

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by rohoneeth »

Personally I wouldn't destroy someone's life over a mistake and just fire them rather than report it. If they have any sense they will start taking things a bit more serious and stop.
If a reference is due, be honest and explain the reason you let go of them. Working with drug taking employees is always a headache. They whine about shift patterns and working late when they need to go for a hit (causing unnecessary drama and headache) or worse, will start taking things on the job.
DavDandy
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2023 9:41 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by DavDandy »

rohoneeth wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:22 pm Personally I wouldn't destroy someone's life over a mistake and just fire them rather than report it. If they have any sense they will start taking things a bit more serious and stop.
If a reference is due, be honest and explain the reason you let go of them. Working with drug taking employees is always a headache. They whine about shift patterns and working late when they need to go for a hit (causing unnecessary drama and headache) or worse, will start taking things on the job.
mistake? How the F is taking drugs a mistake?
NatRox
Posts: 17
Joined: Tue May 02, 2023 2:10 pm

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by NatRox »

hypothetical situation, I watch this forum a lot and it’s great for gaining knowledge from peers. Thanks!
gollwant39
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue May 02, 2023 2:24 pm

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by gollwant39 »

Having recently sat my two day CPC refresher, which was presented by one TC and the ex Senior TC, the advice was very clear: these issues should be reported to the OTC. The reason being that if you do no report, then you are allowing these drivers to fall beneath the radar and not face regulatory action.
JoeFinest
Posts: 8
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2023 9:43 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by JoeFinest »

Ensure back to lab reports back confirming a positive whilst they are suspended then dismissal, oh and point then in the right direction of rehab at the end
Bluecorn
Posts: 376
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2021 6:58 am

Re: My operator has performed a random drugs test to which 2 drivers were found to be positive for drugs, what procedure

Post by Bluecorn »

NatRox wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:17 pm
KarCanyons wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:16 pm
jasSnoop wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 2:16 pm

Thanks for all the responses, the moral side isn’t in question I was asking about the requirements as far as the TC or DVLA are concerned.
Not a conviction so not reportable to either. Follow discipline procedure, and if you don’t have one, seek specialist help. Jumping to dismissal without following the procedure could cost the operator dearly
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