Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
No because it’s not true. No law against it. Depends on drivers contract
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
There is nothing to say about a driver not being planned for a 15 hour shift or a 10 hour drive but the planner/TM must be aware they have a duty of care to that drivers wellbeing
A good planner/TM will try and give notice so the driver can prepare but nothing in the legislation to say they have to, except the HASAWA 1974.
If a driver says they're tired, it's game over for the planner on that shift but it also comes down to the drivers contract and this is where a lot of companies make big mistakes as a driver's employment contract is quite unique as it should cover the operator for circumstances like this
A good planner/TM will try and give notice so the driver can prepare but nothing in the legislation to say they have to, except the HASAWA 1974.
If a driver says they're tired, it's game over for the planner on that shift but it also comes down to the drivers contract and this is where a lot of companies make big mistakes as a driver's employment contract is quite unique as it should cover the operator for circumstances like this
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
If you have the legal hours available they can be planned for. It’s that simple. The only ‘excuse’ a driver can use is that they are ‘tired’. But we all know that ‘excuse’ can’t be used EVERY time a driver doesn’t want to do a few extra hours……pekeritzer43 wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:26 pm There is nothing to say about a driver not being planned for a 15 hour shift or a 10 hour drive but the planner/TM must be aware they have a duty of care to that drivers wellbeing
A good planner/TM will try and give notice so the driver can prepare but nothing in the legislation to say they have to, except the HASAWA 1974.
If a driver says they're tired, it's game over for the planner on that shift but it also comes down to the drivers contract and this is where a lot of companies make big mistakes as a driver's employment contract is quite unique as it should cover the operator for circumstances like this
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
But 15 is work not driving hours. I'm interested in how anyone would think that would be the correct way to plan any work. One slight delay and it's game over.gorntuser40 wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:27 pmIf you have the legal hours available they can be planned for. It’s that simple. The only ‘excuse’ a driver can use is that they are ‘tired’. But we all know that ‘excuse’ can’t be used EVERY time a driver doesn’t want to do a few extra hours……pekeritzer43 wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:26 pm There is nothing to say about a driver not being planned for a 15 hour shift or a 10 hour drive but the planner/TM must be aware they have a duty of care to that drivers wellbeing
A good planner/TM will try and give notice so the driver can prepare but nothing in the legislation to say they have to, except the HASAWA 1974.
If a driver says they're tired, it's game over for the planner on that shift but it also comes down to the drivers contract and this is where a lot of companies make big mistakes as a driver's employment contract is quite unique as it should cover the operator for circumstances like this
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
No legislation against it. It’s not a great idea for a variety of reasons but don’t let a driver tell you it’s against the law.
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
You can plan to the regs, but take note they are limits!
Not targets!
Planning like this can also be deemed irresponsible… one accident and your just as liable!
Not targets!
Planning like this can also be deemed irresponsible… one accident and your just as liable!
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
it can’t be deemed irresponsible because that would make the actual legislation “irresponsible”. As long as drivers are not tired and accept the length of shift, as an operator you are absolutely safe in that respect.
Happy to be corrected if I’m wrong but only with supporting evidence of operators being deemed irresponsible for planning 15hr days
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
no you are right. I know that..bruGrabs wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:28 pmit can’t be deemed irresponsible because that would make the actual legislation “irresponsible”. As long as drivers are not tired and accept the length of shift, as an operator you are absolutely safe in that respect.
Happy to be corrected if I’m wrong but only with supporting evidence of operators being deemed irresponsible for planning 15hr days
But the TC also looks at responsible planning when an incident occurs… there are staff who will work to limits… but I couldn’t sleep at night knowing I have push push push all the time… for us 11hrs a day for tramping is acceptable… anymore then I’ll ask the drivers.. anything less than 11 then it’s because of customs, traffic or a driver actually saying I need to stop..
I could never face a drivers family if they were injured or killed through my ignorant and irresponsible planning or penny pinching ways.
Drivers are humans, this isn’t a sweat shop, trained professionals who we expect the best from… there is a reason footballers are subbed (apart from them being shite or a big pussy ) it’s to protect them…
Be responsible 24/7 or find another way to earn ££££
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
The trouble is planners think they can plan a driver 5 x 15 most of the time!
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
oh but they can. Especially popular when moving containers as a lot of tips are longer than 3hrsartMutivity wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:29 pm The trouble is planners think they can plan a driver 5 x 15 most of the time!
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
that’s where POA comes inbruGrabs wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:30 pmoh but they can. Especially popular when moving containers as a lot of tips are longer than 3hrsartMutivity wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:29 pm The trouble is planners think they can plan a driver 5 x 15 most of the time!
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
that’s down to driver which mode will be used. My lads always stick on break since all of them mostly sleep during that timeollCulver44 wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:30 pmthat’s where POA comes inbruGrabs wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:30 pmoh but they can. Especially popular when moving containers as a lot of tips are longer than 3hrsartMutivity wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:29 pm The trouble is planners think they can plan a driver 5 x 15 most of the time!
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
yes I knowbruGrabs wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:31 pmthat’s down to driver which mode will be used. My lads always stick on break since all of them mostly sleep during that time
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
If a driver has had a 3 hour REST when tipping then it’s technically a maximum 12 hour day when you think about it, so 5 x 15 remark still stands I think you’ll find. I’m happy to be corrected on this…bruGrabs wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:31 pmthat’s down to driver which mode will be used. My lads always stick on break since all of them mostly sleep during that time
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
while technically you could be right, the question was about planning. And from planner’s perspective it’s still a 15hrs shiftSimPride wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:32 pmIf a driver has had a 3 hour REST when tipping then it’s technically a maximum 12 hour day when you think about it, so 5 x 15 remark still stands I think you’ll find. I’m happy to be corrected on this…
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
followed by 9 offSimPride wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:32 pmIf a driver has had a 3 hour REST when tipping then it’s technically a maximum 12 hour day when you think about it, so 5 x 15 remark still stands I think you’ll find. I’m happy to be corrected on this…
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
measured in a 24 hour periodbruGrabs wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:33 pmfollowed by 9 off
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
Nope, 3 hours is a rest not a break so actually I think you’ll find it is not technically a 15 hour shift.bruGrabs wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:33 pmfollowed by 9 off
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
again, from technicality point of view, you are correct.
From planners point of view you aren’t. Driver starts at 6am, 13hr day would finish at 7pm. Having 3hrs of rest while loading means that their day can end at 9pm - 15hrs after their start time.
The 3hr loading/unloading would’ve happened anyway.
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
really? I spent yesterday 5h on loading bay, this is very often.bruGrabs wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:34 pmagain, from technicality point of view, you are correct.
From planners point of view you aren’t. Driver starts at 6am, 13hr day would finish at 7pm. Having 3hrs of rest while loading means that their day can end at 9pm - 15hrs after their start time.
The 3hr loading/unloading would’ve happened anyway.
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
I think you will find you are limited to driving hours for driving but additional work is not legislated as long as you keep within the Drivers working time directive.
That said if you have had drivers working long days and there is an accident expect to be grilled first by HSE then the TC, the first question will be along the lines of what policy and procedure is in place to keep the driver fresh and alert.
That said if you have had drivers working long days and there is an accident expect to be grilled first by HSE then the TC, the first question will be along the lines of what policy and procedure is in place to keep the driver fresh and alert.
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
There isn’t one. Been asked and discussed number of times
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
I wonder why drivers don’t want to continue in this industry??
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
Thank you for the information
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
Basically is such low not allowing from doing that, but it is some rules where says up to driver to decide because no body can force driver to work over his 13h.
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
This really boils me!
They can plan you ANYTHING that is legal.
You can try and use HSE guidelines over fatigue, in that instance I would performance manage your workshy ass out the business, as you clearly aren't up to the job.
If you don't like the hours, hand your notice in, work your notice period, shake the bosses hand on you last day and leave as friends. Don't become a militant, cancerous personality.
They can plan you ANYTHING that is legal.
You can try and use HSE guidelines over fatigue, in that instance I would performance manage your workshy ass out the business, as you clearly aren't up to the job.
If you don't like the hours, hand your notice in, work your notice period, shake the bosses hand on you last day and leave as friends. Don't become a militant, cancerous personality.
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
you know what people like you boils me, that was easy enough question, everybody have different opinion but you need to be rude b*stard, like a turd in the bowl,GarElement wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:37 pm This really boils me!
They can plan you ANYTHING that is legal.
You can try and use HSE guidelines over fatigue, in that instance I would performance manage your workshy ass out the business, as you clearly aren't up to the job.
If you don't like the hours, hand your notice in, work your notice period, shake the bosses hand on you last day and leave as friends. Don't become a militant, cancerous personality.
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
I wasn't rude, I've actually been working hard on accepting people have different standards and allowing that.Waacemin wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:38 pmyou know what people like you boils me, that was easy enough question, everybody have different opinion but you need to be rude b*stard, like a turd in the bowl,GarElement wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:37 pm This really boils me!
They can plan you ANYTHING that is legal.
You can try and use HSE guidelines over fatigue, in that instance I would performance manage your workshy ass out the business, as you clearly aren't up to the job.
If you don't like the hours, hand your notice in, work your notice period, shake the bosses hand on you last day and leave as friends. Don't become a militant, cancerous personality.
You, however, have resorted to name calling. That's not cool.
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
if I worked for someone like you, I’d happily walk away.GarElement wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:37 pm This really boils me!
They can plan you ANYTHING that is legal.
You can try and use HSE guidelines over fatigue, in that instance I would performance manage your workshy ass out the business, as you clearly aren't up to the job.
If you don't like the hours, hand your notice in, work your notice period, shake the bosses hand on you last day and leave as friends. Don't become a militant, cancerous personality.
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
and I'd hope we parted respectfully and on good termsollCulver44 wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:39 pmif I worked for someone like you, I’d happily walk away.GarElement wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:37 pm This really boils me!
They can plan you ANYTHING that is legal.
You can try and use HSE guidelines over fatigue, in that instance I would performance manage your workshy ass out the business, as you clearly aren't up to the job.
If you don't like the hours, hand your notice in, work your notice period, shake the bosses hand on you last day and leave as friends. Don't become a militant, cancerous personality.
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- Joined: Fri May 05, 2023 11:54 am
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
hardly with your attitudeGarElement wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:39 pmand I'd hope we parted respectfully and on good termsollCulver44 wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:39 pmif I worked for someone like you, I’d happily walk away.GarElement wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:37 pm This really boils me!
They can plan you ANYTHING that is legal.
You can try and use HSE guidelines over fatigue, in that instance I would performance manage your workshy ass out the business, as you clearly aren't up to the job.
If you don't like the hours, hand your notice in, work your notice period, shake the bosses hand on you last day and leave as friends. Don't become a militant, cancerous personality.
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- Joined: Thu May 04, 2023 9:51 am
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
luckily, I'm not recruitingollCulver44 wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:40 pmhardly with your attitudeGarElement wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:39 pmand I'd hope we parted respectfully and on good termsollCulver44 wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:39 pm
if I worked for someone like you, I’d happily walk away.
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
561/2006 .....Article 10
Not exactly what you've asked for, but daily 'daily rest requirements' are what caps a single driver shift at 15 hours,...article 10 says (among other things) that an operator must plan the work of drivers in such a way that the driver is able to comply with the daily rest requirements (and the other limits set in these regs)
Not exactly what you've asked for, but daily 'daily rest requirements' are what caps a single driver shift at 15 hours,...article 10 says (among other things) that an operator must plan the work of drivers in such a way that the driver is able to comply with the daily rest requirements (and the other limits set in these regs)
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
Tell him to take his overnight gear. Thinks rarely go to plan in this game
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
it's not about me, was speaking with few drivers and everyone have different opinion and one told that there is a leg for that. For that reason I'm asking just being curious
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
not your business who.
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
I'm interested as to who andLzar11 suggests should be changing jobs?Waacemin wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:43 pmnot your business who.
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
to me IJaySkillful wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:43 pmI'm interested as to who andLzar11 suggests should be changing jobs?
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
I agreeJaySkillful wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:44 pmI'd say he needs a little help with his attitude?Waacemin wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:44 pmto me IJaySkillful wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:43 pm
I'm interested as to who andLzar11 suggests should be changing jobs?
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
As long as you are taking Into consideration 561/2006 plan him how you like
The myth that it is down to the driver to decide if he wants to reduce his daily rest is lies.
The myth that it is down to the driver to decide if he wants to reduce his daily rest is lies.
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
Please can we have some professionalism.
If people want to start their with this is wrong industry for you bull then I'll start and I'll make you look a complete prick so behave
If people want to start their with this is wrong industry for you bull then I'll start and I'll make you look a complete prick so behave
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
As far as I was aware you could only plan a max 12 day, that’s all I would ever plan for, this gives scope for traffic, unloading delays etc
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
If they are planning you for max hours are they pushing you? If they are pushing you to rush to get your work done it then becomes a health and safety issue
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
but they can’t really push you tho. They can plan 24hrs shift but it doesn’t mean that neither it will happen nor that you are obligated to do it. You can only do as much as you can within the timeframeashFortune wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:46 pm If they are planning you for max hours are they pushing you? If they are pushing you to rush to get your work done it then becomes a health and safety issue
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
trust me after 27 years as a driver they can and do push youbruGrabs wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:47 pmbut they can’t really push you tho. They can plan 24hrs shift but it doesn’t mean that neither it will happen nor that you are obligated to do it. You can only do as much as you can within the timeframeashFortune wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:46 pm If they are planning you for max hours are they pushing you? If they are pushing you to rush to get your work done it then becomes a health and safety issue
Ie we have day cabs the traffic office planned for 10 hour drives and pushed the drivers to complete the day's work even tho they had run into traffic earlier in the day
As soon as a driver feels pushed to complete the work given it then becomes a health and safety matter
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
it’s up to the driver to judge if they have sufficient time to complete their tasks and come back to base. If you don’t have enough time, you just bring unit back to the yard.ashFortune wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:47 pmtrust me after 27 years as a driver they can and do push youbruGrabs wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:47 pmbut they can’t really push you tho. They can plan 24hrs shift but it doesn’t mean that neither it will happen nor that you are obligated to do it. You can only do as much as you can within the timeframeashFortune wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:46 pm If they are planning you for max hours are they pushing you? If they are pushing you to rush to get your work done it then becomes a health and safety issue
Ie we have day cabs the traffic office planned for 10 hour drives and pushed the drivers to complete the day's work even tho they had run into traffic earlier in the day
As soon as a driver feels pushed to complete the work given it then becomes a health and safety matter
Although I know what you are saying and seen some shady stuff go down in one company delivering frozen goods where planners used to plan it so tight that day drivers used to night out couple times a week, but only those who would “take it on a chin” others used to bring their units back with zero care. And especially over last few years things have changed quite dramatically in terms of drivers having final say on what they can or can’t do
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
problem is you can only take a unit back with zero care so many times before you are next to gobruGrabs wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:48 pmit’s up to the driver to judge if they have sufficient time to complete their tasks and come back to base. If you don’t have enough time, you just bring unit back to the yard.ashFortune wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:47 pmtrust me after 27 years as a driver they can and do push you
Ie we have day cabs the traffic office planned for 10 hour drives and pushed the drivers to complete the day's work even tho they had run into traffic earlier in the day
As soon as a driver feels pushed to complete the work given it then becomes a health and safety matter
Although I know what you are saying and seen some shady stuff go down in one company delivering frozen goods where planners used to plan it so tight that day drivers used to night out couple times a week, but only those who would “take it on a chin” others used to bring their units back with zero care. And especially over last few years things have changed quite dramatically in terms of drivers having final say on what they can or can’t do
Having been on both sides I've seen drivers get pushed to complete the work they have been given
And also had planners try to push me guess which Outlook I took
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
Did you ask the drivers if they want to work 15 hours
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
No such thing. Legislation says work can be planned as long as it is legal and adheres to driver's hours..
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
The Drivers Regs EU 561/2006 rule says 9hrs driving may extended to 10hrs and 11hrs rest may be reduced reduced to 9hrs. This is is at drivers discretion.
So the answer is no you can't plan for a 15hr day
13hrs max allowing for 11hr rest period.
15hrs is for delays in loading and traffic.
If there is planner doing that then he needs retraining.
Obviously the planner is under the supervision of the TM and he needs reporting for not taking consideration the Eu 561/2006 as written.
The way you get around that is if the driver has 3hr rest en bloc within his 15hr shift followed by a 9hr and must completed within a 24hr working day.
You'll find container companies use this pattern where it can take over 3 hrs to tip but the unit must be disconnected from the trailer.
So the answer is no you can't plan for a 15hr day
13hrs max allowing for 11hr rest period.
15hrs is for delays in loading and traffic.
If there is planner doing that then he needs retraining.
Obviously the planner is under the supervision of the TM and he needs reporting for not taking consideration the Eu 561/2006 as written.
The way you get around that is if the driver has 3hr rest en bloc within his 15hr shift followed by a 9hr and must completed within a 24hr working day.
You'll find container companies use this pattern where it can take over 3 hrs to tip but the unit must be disconnected from the trailer.
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
it doesn’t say in legislation that you can’t plan for 15hr day.deeWise5 wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:50 pm The Drivers Regs EU 561/2006 rule says 9hrs driving may extended to 10hrs and 11hrs rest may be reduced reduced to 9hrs. This is is at drivers discretion.
So the answer is no you can't plan for a 15hr day
13hrs max allowing for 11hr rest period.
15hrs is for delays in loading and traffic.
If there is planner doing that then he needs retraining.
Obviously the planner is under the supervision of the TM and he needs reporting for not taking consideration the Eu 561/2006 as written.
The way you get around that is if the driver has 3hr rest en bloc within his 15hr shift followed by a 9hr and must completed within a 24hr working day.
You'll find container companies use this pattern where it can take over 3 hrs to tip but the unit must be disconnected from the trailer.
Also it doesn’t say that unit has to be uncoupled either.
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
I’ll go as far say that it doesn’t say that 15hr day is at drivers discretion.deeWise5 wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:50 pm The Drivers Regs EU 561/2006 rule says 9hrs driving may extended to 10hrs and 11hrs rest may be reduced reduced to 9hrs. This is is at drivers discretion.
So the answer is no you can't plan for a 15hr day
13hrs max allowing for 11hr rest period.
15hrs is for delays in loading and traffic.
If there is planner doing that then he needs retraining.
Obviously the planner is under the supervision of the TM and he needs reporting for not taking consideration the Eu 561/2006 as written.
The way you get around that is if the driver has 3hr rest en bloc within his 15hr shift followed by a 9hr and must completed within a 24hr working day.
You'll find container companies use this pattern where it can take over 3 hrs to tip but the unit must be disconnected from the trailer.
The only discretion driver has is to say that they are tired. But you can only say that so many times before you can be pulled in to assess your suitability for the job.
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
You have to take in consideration on the Driving periods and daily rest periods. Its up to the driver if he uses the extra. A drivers standard shift is 13hrs... I been a driver, Union rep, TM and Business owner, Seen it all!bruGrabs wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:50 pmI’ll go as far say that it doesn’t say that 15hr day is at drivers discretion.deeWise5 wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:50 pm The Drivers Regs EU 561/2006 rule says 9hrs driving may extended to 10hrs and 11hrs rest may be reduced reduced to 9hrs. This is is at drivers discretion.
So the answer is no you can't plan for a 15hr day
13hrs max allowing for 11hr rest period.
15hrs is for delays in loading and traffic.
If there is planner doing that then he needs retraining.
Obviously the planner is under the supervision of the TM and he needs reporting for not taking consideration the Eu 561/2006 as written.
The way you get around that is if the driver has 3hr rest en bloc within his 15hr shift followed by a 9hr and must completed within a 24hr working day.
You'll find container companies use this pattern where it can take over 3 hrs to tip but the unit must be disconnected from the trailer.
The only discretion driver has is to say that they are tired. But you can only say that so many times before you can be pulled in to assess your suitability for the job.
Regarding the uncoupling. You are not at rest if your vehicle is being unloaded and your in the vehicle.
For the 3hr period you need access to a bunk. Vosa will fine your driver if caught.
Ie they will sit outside an RDC and watch and wait. Then they'll mess your day up.
Happens many at time up at Haydock and Crick Safest way uncouple and park up..
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
Work has to be done ! A good planner would plan shorter days towards end of week
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
There's no way any driver should be planned for a 15 hour day . Traffic delays , accidents filling up delays on site all need to be accounted for so if you plan from A-B -C-D etc and have all 15 hours taken up guaranteed the run wont be completed unless the driver breaks the law.
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
Tell the driver to do as they are told. The company pays the wages and the truck won’t make money if it’s parked up.
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
I would not like to be under you. I agree however there are different circumstances, maybe driver don't feel very well or is sick or just tired because was doing the day before 15h, you need to think about that also
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
working in the haulage industry the truck needs to make money. If a driver refuses to work to his legal hours then he is in the wrong job.
As an employer, would you employ a driver that refused to work?
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
yes I would if that would be a good driver that is giving everything the best from him/her, for me customer care and happy driver is everything because then image of the company is showing that drivers are happy in place they work. If one driver will say no for 15h because lest say he or she is not feeling well then ask another driverPadFreex wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:53 pmworking in the haulage industry the truck needs to make money. If a driver refuses to work to his legal hours then he is in the wrong job.
As an employer, would you employ a driver that refused to work?
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Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
well said on this one. Why should someone work 45 hours in 3 days when for example, I do 36-40 hours in one week, the poor driver will have already done this by day 3. Drivers eventually break when made to work excessive hours, its a shame certain parts of our industry treats them as a disposable commodity then when they do break, will bring in another person to work the 60 hour weeks without thinking twice. I haven’t driven for a long time now and when I did very occasionally drive, it was in a line of the industry where respect was a given, Livestock Haulage to be precise. If only this approach could be given across the market as a whole.Waacemin wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:54 pmyes I would if that would be a good driver that is giving everything the best from him/her, for me customer care and happy driver is everything because then image of the company is showing that drivers are happy in place they work. If one driver will say no for 15h because lest say he or she is not feeling well then ask another driver
Re: Quick question, if anyone know about some sort of legislation telling that planner can't plan 15h day for a drivers?
even in livestock now is hard for driversmatvanami89 wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:54 pmwell said on this one. Why should someone work 45 hours in 3 days when for example, I do 36-40 hours in one week, the poor driver will have already done this by day 3. Drivers eventually break when made to work excessive hours, its a shame certain parts of our industry treats them as a disposable commodity then when they do break, will bring in another person to work the 60 hour weeks without thinking twice. I haven’t driven for a long time now and when I did very occasionally drive, it was in a line of the industry where respect was a given, Livestock Haulage to be precise. If only this approach could be given across the market as a whole.Waacemin wrote: ↑Sat May 06, 2023 2:54 pmyes I would if that would be a good driver that is giving everything the best from him/her, for me customer care and happy driver is everything because then image of the company is showing that drivers are happy in place they work. If one driver will say no for 15h because lest say he or she is not feeling well then ask another driver
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