CAN ANY ONE ADVISE ME ON THE OPERATOR THING? I HAVE A 5 TONNE VEHICLE TRANSPORTER WHICH I USE FOR MY CAR SALES

[Aldus_Hyce]

I HAVE A 5 TONNE VEHICLE TRANSPORTER WHICH I USE FOR MY CAR SALES BUSINESS.
I HAVE BEEN STOPPED AND FINED AND TOLD I NEED TO COMPLETE MY CPC AND GET TACO CARD AND I NEED A OPERATERS CERTIFICATE OR SOME THING.
I HAVE NOW GOT MY TACO CARD AND ENROLLED TO DO THE 35 HOURS CPC ONLINE. CAN ANY ONE ADVISE ME ON THE OPERATOR THING?

[Russvillo]

You need an operators licence. As you will be carrying other people's goods. You need to employ a transport manager where in the country are you based?

[Aldus_Hyce]

You need an operators licence. As you will be carrying other people's goods. You need to employ a transport manager where in the country are you based?

I'm based in Luton, the goods belong to me. The ownership of delivered vehicles is only done after delivery

[Phillero]

You need an operators licence. As you will be carrying other people's goods. You need to employ a transport manager where in the country are you based?

I'm based in Luton, the goods belong to me. The ownership of delivered vehicles is only done after delivery

they don’t pay a deposit?

[Aldus_Hyce]

You need an operators licence. As you will be carrying other people's goods. You need to employ a transport manager where in the country are you based?

I'm based in Luton, the goods belong to me. The ownership of delivered vehicles is only done after delivery

they don’t pay a deposit?

yes they pay a refundable deposit. But ownership is not changed until the vehicle is delivered and they are satisfied with everything. So after it's delivered and I then receive payment then ownership is transferred

[Hussinfo464]

I'm based in Luton, the goods belong to me. The ownership of delivered vehicles is only done after delivery

they don’t pay a deposit?

yes they pay a refundable deposit. But ownership is not changed until the vehicle is delivered and they are satisfied with everything. So after it's delivered and I then receive payment then ownership is transferred

you need standard Operators License Bro. As you also charge for deliveries. It will save you lots of grief if you get standard license Bro

[colinvest]

I'm based in Luton, the goods belong to me. The ownership of delivered vehicles is only done after delivery

they don’t pay a deposit?

yes they pay a refundable deposit. But ownership is not changed until the vehicle is delivered and they are satisfied with everything. So after it's delivered and I then receive payment then ownership is transferred

can you in good conscience say that you are basically transporting your car to somewhere for someone to view it before considering whether they purchase it or not? I.e, you take it to their house, look at it and say, "actually no, I don't want to buy that" and you take it back again?
Other than not following the rules of operating a larger vehicle, I'm going to say this... I'm glad you aren't delivering on a 3.5 car transporter. Once you have your operators licence, you can operate a safer vehicle all legit.

[Aldus_Hyce]

they don’t pay a deposit?

yes they pay a refundable deposit. But ownership is not changed until the vehicle is delivered and they are satisfied with everything. So after it's delivered and I then receive payment then ownership is transferred

can you in good conscience say that you are basically transporting your car to somewhere for someone to view it before considering whether they purchase it or not? I.e, you take it to their house, look at it and say, "actually no, I don't want to buy that" and you take it back again?
Other than not following the rules of operating a larger vehicle, I'm going to say this... I'm glad you aren't delivering on a 3.5 car transporter. Once you have your operators licence, you can operate a safer vehicle all legit.

iv never had a potential customer turn a car away. Before I deliver the a detailed video is sent so I only deliver when I'm 99% confident of a sale.

[Russvillo]

You need an operators licence. As you will be carrying other people's goods. You need to employ a transport manager where in the country are you based?

I'm based in Luton, the goods belong to me. The ownership of delivered vehicles is only done after delivery

TC won't see it like that. You will need a standard national o licence and a transport manager.

[Jordando]

https://www.gov.uk/apply-vehicle-operator-licence

[Aldus_Hyce]

https://www.gov.uk/apply-vehicle-operator-licence

thank you

[Admin5]

https://transportforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=97

[Aldus_Hyce]

https://transportforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=97

thanks

[Dalebber]

A lot depends on what you are actually doing. If you are transporting your own goods and not carrying anything belonging to anyone else you should only need a restricted licence that doesn’t need a transport managers qualification. But this means nothing for hire or reward and your own goods. I can see the sticking point here being if you have sold a vehicle to somebody then deliver it you would be carrying something that doesn’t belong to you so that would need a std licence requiring a transport managers qualification.

[Aldus_Hyce]

A lot depends on what you are actually doing. If you are transporting your own goods and not carrying anything belonging to anyone else you should only need a restricted licence that doesn’t need a transport managers qualification. But this means nothing for hire or reward and your own goods. I can see the sticking point here being if you have sold a vehicle to somebody then deliver it you would be carrying something that doesn’t belong to you so that would need a std licence requiring a transport managers qualification.

the thing is it's my car sales business and use the truck to collect cars I have bought my self and occasionally delivery cars to customers but only charge them upon delivery for the car.

[Dalebber]

A lot depends on what you are actually doing. If you are transporting your own goods and not carrying anything belonging to anyone else you should only need a restricted licence that doesn’t need a transport managers qualification. But this means nothing for hire or reward and your own goods. I can see the sticking point here being if you have sold a vehicle to somebody then deliver it you would be carrying something that doesn’t belong to you so that would need a std licence requiring a transport managers qualification.

the thing is it's my car sales business and use the truck to collect cars I have bought my self and occasionally delivery cars to customers but only charge them upon delivery for the car.

If it’s your property then a restricted licence is all you need is my understanding.

[Aldus_Hyce]

A lot depends on what you are actually doing. If you are transporting your own goods and not carrying anything belonging to anyone else you should only need a restricted licence that doesn’t need a transport managers qualification. But this means nothing for hire or reward and your own goods. I can see the sticking point here being if you have sold a vehicle to somebody then deliver it you would be carrying something that doesn’t belong to you so that would need a std licence requiring a transport managers qualification.

the thing is it's my car sales business and use the truck to collect cars I have bought my self and occasionally delivery cars to customers but only charge them upon delivery for the car.

If it’s your property then a restricted licence is all you need is my understanding.

can you point me in the right direction to get restricted licence

[Dalebber]

the thing is it's my car sales business and use the truck to collect cars I have bought my self and occasionally delivery cars to customers but only charge them upon delivery for the car.

If it’s your property then a restricted licence is all you need is my understanding.

can you point me in the right direction to get restricted licence

The link is posted above earlier in the thread

[Simption]

A lot depends on what you are actually doing. If you are transporting your own goods and not carrying anything belonging to anyone else you should only need a restricted licence that doesn’t need a transport managers qualification. But this means nothing for hire or reward and your own goods. I can see the sticking point here being if you have sold a vehicle to somebody then deliver it you would be carrying something that doesn’t belong to you so that would need a std licence requiring a transport managers qualification.

hi Dalebber it's a standard licence he needs as there's reward of his sold cars.

[Dalebber]

A lot depends on what you are actually doing. If you are transporting your own goods and not carrying anything belonging to anyone else you should only need a restricted licence that doesn’t need a transport managers qualification. But this means nothing for hire or reward and your own goods. I can see the sticking point here being if you have sold a vehicle to somebody then deliver it you would be carrying something that doesn’t belong to you so that would need a std licence requiring a transport managers qualification.

hi Dalebber it's a standard licence he needs as there's reward of his sold cars.

There’s reward in any business otherwise it wouldn’t be a business. As I understand it, and I know of many who run on restricted, as long as the goods are his property then restricted is all he needs. If however it’s proved that an element of the resale value includes a delivery charge then a std would be required. As far as collecting purchased vehicles then a restricted is all he needs.

[Kurisure]

the thing is it's my car sales business and use the truck to collect cars I have bought my self and occasionally delivery cars to customers but only charge them upon delivery for the car.

If it’s your property then a restricted licence is all you need is my understanding.

can you point me in the right direction to get restricted licence

if you are making money from them cars then it is hire and reward so you will need a standard OL

[Simption]

A lot depends on what you are actually doing. If you are transporting your own goods and not carrying anything belonging to anyone else you should only need a restricted licence that doesn’t need a transport managers qualification. But this means nothing for hire or reward and your own goods. I can see the sticking point here being if you have sold a vehicle to somebody then deliver it you would be carrying something that doesn’t belong to you so that would need a std licence requiring a transport managers qualification.

hi Dalebber it's a standard licence he needs as there's reward of his sold cars.

There’s reward in any business otherwise it wouldn’t be a business. As I understand it, and I know of many who run on restricted, as long as the goods are his property then restricted is all he needs. If however it’s proved that an element of the resale value includes a delivery charge then a std would be required. As far as collecting purchased vehicles then a restricted is all he needs.

it doesn't work that way in car transport mate. It would be nice if it was a restricted licence but it doesn't fall under that. Let's say he was a car collector moving 10 cars from one place to another to store them with no reward it would be restricted, but the minute there is any reward attached at any point it fall out of restricted into the next licence up (standard)

[Hussinfo464]

If it’s your property then a restricted licence is all you need is my understanding.

can you point me in the right direction to get restricted licence

if you are making money from them cars then it is hire and reward so you will need a standard OL

not only that. He charges Hus customers for delivery. That is Hire And Reward in my opinion and as you rightly said standard License required!

[Aldus_Hyce]

can you point me in the right direction to get restricted licence

if you are making money from them cars then it is hire and reward so you will need a standard OL

not only that. He charges Hus customers for delivery. That is Hire And Reward in my opinion and as you rightly said standard License required!

are you a psychic? How do you know if I charge for delivery? You don't know anything about my business

[Hussinfo464]

if you are making money from them cars then it is hire and reward so you will need a standard OL

not only that. He charges Hus customers for delivery. That is Hire And Reward in my opinion and as you rightly said standard License required!

are you a psychic? How do you know if I charge for delivery? You don't know anything about my business

you said yourself in your response to one of the comments that your customers pay for delivery after you deliver the cars.
Anyway
Please do whatever you think is best I was just giving you my opinion on your question
Thanks

[Hussinfo464]

if you are making money from them cars then it is hire and reward so you will need a standard OL

not only that. He charges Hus customers for delivery. That is Hire And Reward in my opinion and as you rightly said standard License required!

are you a psychic? How do you know if I charge for delivery? You don't know anything about my business

I got that from your comment. Anyway no need to be rude I only gave my opinion
Please do as it suits you
Thanks

[Aldus_Hyce]

not only that. He charges Hus customers for delivery. That is Hire And Reward in my opinion and as you rightly said standard License required!

are you a psychic? How do you know if I charge for delivery? You don't know anything about my business

I got that from your comment. Anyway no need to be rude I only gave my opinion
Please do as it suits you
Thanks

the truck is used by my self for my business. The business is a used car sales business, so I use the truck to collect cars purchased by me, transport my vehicles to various places for servicing or repairs, and deliver cars to customers who want to purchase them. Any customer who wants to a car delivered to there home has to pay a reserving deposit. The vehicle always belongs to me until full payment is made and full payment is made after vehicle is delivered. I do not transport vehicles not owned by me.

[Aldus_Hyce]

not only that. He charges Hus customers for delivery. That is Hire And Reward in my opinion and as you rightly said standard License required!

are you a psychic? How do you know if I charge for delivery? You don't know anything about my business

you said yourself in your response to one of the comments that your customers pay for delivery after you deliver the cars.
Anyway
Please do whatever you think is best I was just giving you my opinion on your question
Thanks

re read it, if I'm selling a car I only charge for the car once delivered. They pay for the car

[Hussinfo464]

are you a psychic? How do you know if I charge for delivery? You don't know anything about my business

you said yourself in your response to one of the comments that your customers pay for delivery after you deliver the cars.
Anyway
Please do whatever you think is best I was just giving you my opinion on your question
Thanks

re read it, if I'm selling a car I only charge for the car once delivered. They pay for the car

please ignore my message and kindly move on
Thanks

[benines]

can you point me in the right direction to get restricted licence

if you are making money from them cars then it is hire and reward so you will need a standard OL

not only that. He charges Hus customers for delivery. That is Hire And Reward in my opinion and as you rightly said standard License required!

Incorrect, it’s fine to charge for delivery on a restricted licence.

[benines]

A lot depends on what you are actually doing. If you are transporting your own goods and not carrying anything belonging to anyone else you should only need a restricted licence that doesn’t need a transport managers qualification. But this means nothing for hire or reward and your own goods. I can see the sticking point here being if you have sold a vehicle to somebody then deliver it you would be carrying something that doesn’t belong to you so that would need a std licence requiring a transport managers qualification.

hi Dalebber it's a standard licence he needs as there's reward of his sold cars.

I too have a 5ton, no I'm not involved in car sakes rather the movement of the vehicle when sold or transfer between sites. I am a qualified transport manager with an international CPC and a Goods Opertors Licence for over 7 years. The answer to the question is as the authorities have said, OL, tacho, DCPC and as you have said, you deliver the occasional car so by default, Standard National not restricted, do NOT use or even think about using the vehicle until then. See https://www.gov.uk/ for all the need requirement under Guide to Opertors Licence " and good luck as a first time person applying, allow 12-13 weeks, assuming you have a suitable goods operators centre, you are of good repute with no unspent conviction or bankruptcy history, can show financial standing, have a maintenance contract with a qualified service garage, and can employ a external transport manager which will cost around £400 a month.

[KB7ingeers]

You can hire people to manage your O licence side of things or do the qualifications

[Aldus_Hyce]

You can hire people to manage your O licence side of things or do the qualifications

what's the ball park figure to hire some one to manage the O licence for 1 truck? seeing all this info it's looking like not worth me keeping this truck and just pay others to collect and deliver the cars not worth the headache it seems

[KB7ingeers]

You can hire people to manage your O licence side of things or do the qualifications

what's the ball park figure to hire some one to manage the O licence for 1 truck? seeing all this info it's looking like not worth me keeping this truck and just pay others to collect and deliver the cars not worth the headache it seems

I truthful don't know...contact your nearest managers CPC training location and ask the trainer to recommend someone locally or an HGV driving agency may have a freelance CPC holder

[Kurisure]

Yes you need to find your self a transport manager to put you application in to the traffic commissioner. You will need an operating centre and put an add in the news paper telling people you will be operating a lorry from that centre. You will also need around £8750 in the bank at all times and show evidence of this.

[jinChat]

A lot of incorrect information here.
The vehicle is part of the business, selling it or charging for delivery has nothing to do with 'hire and reward'. In this case, as described in original post, a restricted licence is required.
If you move a vehicle for another car sales business and benefit directly or indirectly, then you require a standard licence, as this is hire and reward.

[Aldus_Hyce]

A lot of incorrect information here.
The vehicle is part of the business, selling it or charging for delivery has nothing to do with 'hire and reward'. In this case, as described in original post, a restricted licence is required.
If you move a vehicle for another car sales business and benefit directly or indirectly, then you require a standard licence, as this is hire and reward.

thank you for clarification, yes the truck is used to collect, deliver, move cars to garages for servicing or repairs. These cars belong to the business and no cars transported for any one else or any other business, the business makes money from sales of cars

[Jarman]

A lot of incorrect information here.
The vehicle is part of the business, selling it or charging for delivery has nothing to do with 'hire and reward'. In this case, as described in original post, a restricted licence is required.
If you move a vehicle for another car sales business and benefit directly or indirectly, then you require a standard licence, as this is hire and reward.

thank you for clarification, yes the truck is used to collect, deliver, move cars to garages for servicing or repairs. These cars belong to the business and no cars transported for any one else or any other business, the business makes money from sales of cars

you said already you deliver cars to customers, if you feel you are above the law, you crack on, your vehicle is already on the radar. Read the guide to Goods Opertors Licence, it's official, correct and stop arguing the toss so some agrees with you. If you cannot be arsed to read the guide, call DVSA tomorrow, tell um you deliver the " occasional" car to new owners after you've sent them a video, THEN YOU CAN COME BACK AND eat humble pie. To others who feel differently, read up on the law and stick to yer 3500kg ex supermarket trolley. I think that will do for this post?

[Aldus_Hyce]

A lot of incorrect information here.
The vehicle is part of the business, selling it or charging for delivery has nothing to do with 'hire and reward'. In this case, as described in original post, a restricted licence is required.
If you move a vehicle for another car sales business and benefit directly or indirectly, then you require a standard licence, as this is hire and reward.

thank you for clarification, yes the truck is used to collect, deliver, move cars to garages for servicing or repairs. These cars belong to the business and no cars transported for any one else or any other business, the business makes money from sales of cars

you said already you deliver cars to customers, if you feel you are above the law, you crack on, your vehicle is already on the radar. Read the guide to Goods Opertors Licence, it's official, correct and stop arguing the toss so some agrees with you. If you cannot be arsed to read the guide, call DVSA tomorrow, tell um you deliver the " occasional" car to new owners after you've sent them a video, THEN YOU CAN COME BACK AND eat humble pie. To others who feel differently, read up on the law and stick to yer 3500kg ex supermarket trolley. I think that will do for this post?

no need to be angry man

[jinChat]

A lot of incorrect information here.
The vehicle is part of the business, selling it or charging for delivery has nothing to do with 'hire and reward'. In this case, as described in original post, a restricted licence is required.
If you move a vehicle for another car sales business and benefit directly or indirectly, then you require a standard licence, as this is hire and reward.

thank you for clarification, yes the truck is used to collect, deliver, move cars to garages for servicing or repairs. These cars belong to the business and no cars transported for any one else or any other business, the business makes money from sales of cars

you said already you deliver cars to customers, if you feel you are above the law, you crack on, your vehicle is already on the radar. Read the guide to Goods Opertors Licence, it's official, correct and stop arguing the toss so some agrees with you. If you cannot be arsed to read the guide, call DVSA tomorrow, tell um you deliver the " occasional" car to new owners after you've sent them a video, THEN YOU CAN COME BACK AND eat humble pie. To others who feel differently, read up on the law and stick to yer 3500kg ex supermarket trolley. I think that will do for this post?

delivery of a car sold by the operator is not hire and reward.
Delivery of a car on behalf of another dealer is.

[Jarman]

thank you for clarification, yes the truck is used to collect, deliver, move cars to garages for servicing or repairs. These cars belong to the business and no cars transported for any one else or any other business, the business makes money from sales of cars

you said already you deliver cars to customers, if you feel you are above the law, you crack on, your vehicle is already on the radar. Read the guide to Goods Opertors Licence, it's official, correct and stop arguing the toss so some agrees with you. If you cannot be arsed to read the guide, call DVSA tomorrow, tell um you deliver the " occasional" car to new owners after you've sent them a video, THEN YOU CAN COME BACK AND eat humble pie. To others who feel differently, read up on the law and stick to yer 3500kg ex supermarket trolley. I think that will do for this post?

delivery of a car sold by the operator is not hire and reward.
Delivery of a car on behalf of another dealer is.

What part of "reward" do you not understand?

[jinChat]

you said already you deliver cars to customers, if you feel you are above the law, you crack on, your vehicle is already on the radar. Read the guide to Goods Opertors Licence, it's official, correct and stop arguing the toss so some agrees with you. If you cannot be arsed to read the guide, call DVSA tomorrow, tell um you deliver the " occasional" car to new owners after you've sent them a video, THEN YOU CAN COME BACK AND eat humble pie. To others who feel differently, read up on the law and stick to yer 3500kg ex supermarket trolley. I think that will do for this post?

delivery of a car sold by the operator is not hire and reward.
Delivery of a car on behalf of another dealer is.

What part of "reward" do you not understand?

I understand it fully.

[Aldus_Hyce]

you said already you deliver cars to customers, if you feel you are above the law, you crack on, your vehicle is already on the radar. Read the guide to Goods Opertors Licence, it's official, correct and stop arguing the toss so some agrees with you. If you cannot be arsed to read the guide, call DVSA tomorrow, tell um you deliver the " occasional" car to new owners after you've sent them a video, THEN YOU CAN COME BACK AND eat humble pie. To others who feel differently, read up on the law and stick to yer 3500kg ex supermarket trolley. I think that will do for this post?

delivery of a car sold by the operator is not hire and reward.
Delivery of a car on behalf of another dealer is.

What part of "reward" do you not understand?

as long as the vehicle is on our truck it belongs to the business. The payment for vehicle and transfer if ownership takes place after being delivered to buyer. This is only 1 part of the use of the truck. We use the truck to transport only our cars for various reasons. And now I have done my research and spoke to a few people who understand this area very well and the restricted O licence is what is needed.

[michal2hot]

Yea two ways around this if you still want to transport, 1)employ or subcontract a transport manager for a short period like myself to get you properly running legally, with all inspections/systems in place so u can keep moving without further penalties or 2)get your own qualifications and be your own Transport Manager, but you'd still need to go through point 1) in the process of 2) if u wish to keep it going. If you are in 60mile radius of Bristol and surrounding area I'm happy to help you.