Hi everyone. I have a situation, please advise. One of the Coach Drivers was caught on drugs while driving. He can

AndryUrman · Post by **AndryUrman** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:23 pm

Hi everyone.
I have a situation, please advise.
One of the Coach Drivers was caught on drugs while driving.
He received a letter to be present in the court.
He can drive until a final decision is make or should stop driving now?
Thank you.

JinWisdom · Post by **JinWisdom** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:25 pm

Stop him driving unless he allows you to drug test him prior to every shift.

mcIdol · Post by **mcIdol** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:25 pm

Technically innocent until proven guilty, but would I allow him behind the wheel of a coach full of passengers? definitely not.

alasyBesto · Post by **alasyBesto** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:29 pm

Personally I would stop that person from driving with immediate affect. How do you without a drugs test at the start and finish of a shift they are not under the influence?? If they hold a vocational licence obviously they don't consider themselves a professional driver!!

dazdesk · Post by **dazdesk** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:30 pm

Depends on your contract of employment but I would suspend pending investigation inline with the contract of employment disciplinary process.

BillStill · Post by **BillStill** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:30 pm

What do your policies say? Gross misconduct in mine!

gazergooble · Post by **gazergooble** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:30 pm

Whoa , hang on a minute .
‘ Caught on drugs ‘
What sort of drugs ?
Railway drug testing can get you banned for having a poppy seed bun in your snack or taking codeine for pain relief .

Sullivate · Post by **Sullivate** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:31 pm

gazergooble wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:30 pm Whoa , hang on a minute .
‘ Caught on drugs ‘
What sort of drugs ?
Railway drug testing can get you banned for having a poppy seed bun in your snack or taking codeine for pain relief .

but it's not likely to have you end up in court though, is it?

gazergooble · Post by **gazergooble** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:31 pm

Sullivate wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:31 pm
gazergooble wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:30 pm Whoa , hang on a minute .
‘ Caught on drugs ‘
What sort of drugs ?
Railway drug testing can get you banned for having a poppy seed bun in your snack or taking codeine for pain relief .
but it's not likely to have you end up in court though, is it?

Hence my question as to what type of drugs

Brookay · Post by **Brookay** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:32 pm

gazergooble wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:30 pm Whoa , hang on a minute .
‘ Caught on drugs ‘
What sort of drugs ?
Railway drug testing can get you banned for having a poppy seed bun in your snack or taking codeine for pain relief .

as a driver it’s your responsibility to make sure that you can drive on these drugs. Athletes require you do this so why not drivers

Barryzi8 · Post by **Barryzi8** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:33 pm

A full investigation needs to be conducted, and a statement made by the driver. Depending on what’s in your policies and procedures regarding drugs and alcohol. Personally, driver would be immediately suspended, pending investigation findings.

benines · Post by **benines** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:33 pm

Barryzi8 wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:33 pm A full investigation needs to be conducted, and a statement made by the driver. Depending on what’s in your policies and procedures regarding drugs and alcohol. Personally, driver would be immediately suspended, pending investigation findings.

This. Suspend but don’t sack until the court case. If can’t afford to suspend him on full pay for no work, get him washing / cleaning / answering the phone.

ChrisReal · Post by **ChrisReal** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:34 pm

I do find it very concerning that people need to ask questions like this!!
It is operators like this that are giving our industries a bad reputation..

matt.33 · Post by **matt.33** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:34 pm

Who was he caught by? If "caught while driving" by the police or DVSA then he'd receive an automatic driving ban anyway. Drug driving is also gross misconduct in 99% of company policies and, in case you don't realise, the TC doesn't like it either.
Driving a company vehicle, carrying company's customers, not good for company reputation, so bringing company into disrepute is also gross misconduct in 99% of policies.
The very fact that you're willing to even entertain the idea of allowing this driver to, not only remain in your employment, but are seemingly happy to allow him to continue driving, is a very concerning and horrific thought.
Upon hearing of this situation I wouldn't just want to stay away from the driver, but I'd have serious doubts of doing business with the company. So, put yourself in the shoes of the outsider (I.e, passenger) and then make your decision....

jaxon · Post by **jaxon** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:35 pm

Suspend driver from driving duties. Put him to do other work rather than at home on full pay. Once court case has been finalized. You will have your decision on if they broke the law.

Kamen.IIon · Post by **Kamen.IIon** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:36 pm

Need to be suspended

Peteines · Post by **Peteines** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:36 pm

Drug driving is no different to drink driving same penalties, it's a driving ban!
But was is prescription drugs or illegal drugs?
What letter is the driver presenting to court?
At the very least he should be suspended until the court case.

Rickdist · Post by **Rickdist** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:37 pm

Suspend on full pay he has to go to court if you sack him and he is found not guilty on a technicality you could end up with a tribunal. Was it hard drugs or prescribed you need to be fully aware

Lo-Luckyro · Post by **Lo-Luckyro** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:37 pm

Gross misconduct....you have to be seen to be doing, the outcome is inevitable...he has to be gone, no question.

Dawnette · Post by **Dawnette** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:38 pm

Lo-Luckyro wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:37 pm Gross misconduct....you have to be seen to be doing, the outcome is inevitable...he has to be gone, no question.

what if its prescription drugs, these can put u over limit, not enough info, your assuming that it's illegal drugs. Innocent until proven guilty.

Brookay · Post by **Brookay** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:38 pm

Dawnette wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:38 pm
Lo-Luckyro wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:37 pm Gross misconduct....you have to be seen to be doing, the outcome is inevitable...he has to be gone, no question.
what if its prescription drugs, these can put u over limit, not enough info, your assuming that it's illegal drugs. Innocent until proven guilty.

if you get drugs from the doctor it’s your responsibility to make sure you can drive on them. It’s your license look after it

Dawnette · Post by **Dawnette** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:39 pm

Brookay wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:38 pm
Dawnette wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:38 pm
Lo-Luckyro wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:37 pm Gross misconduct....you have to be seen to be doing, the outcome is inevitable...he has to be gone, no question.
what if its prescription drugs, these can put u over limit, not enough info, your assuming that it's illegal drugs. Innocent until proven guilty.
if you get drugs from the doctor it’s your responsibility to make sure you can drive on them. It’s your license look after it

yes but you have to put up a medical defence, as some prescription drugs now test positive for being over limit, when ur not. Then it's proving that it impaired your judgement.

Davalla · Post by **Davalla** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:40 pm

Technically innocent until proven guilty, but what does your Disciplinary Policy say ?.As Dazdesk says suspend on full pay.If he's convicted it's a done deal.

HarNess · Post by **HarNess** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:40 pm

Gardening leave until full fa is established

flitts · Post by **flitts** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:41 pm

How long has said driver been employed ??

timagel · Post by **timagel** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:42 pm

Not enough info given. What drugs, recreational or legitimate medical prescription or other the counter ? If prescribed then unless been given the heavy weight ones where a Dr says definitely no driving it becomes advisory ie “ You may become drowsy “ Ask a Gp to verify you’re safe on lower dosage opiates they’ll mostly say it’s hard to work out. The drug is measured in Mg, the legal limit in blood is Mul if I remember right without going on Google. Prolonged use of say 30/500 CoCodamal will likely not make the user drowsy as they become sensitized to them, anyone else just taking them will get drowsy. Shows on a blood test as an opiate but a different kind of marker to other opiates drugs. They won’t show on a drug test 10 hrs later. If this is a case of prescribed drugs then that’s his defence in law and what his drs have advised so if just over the limit the court may be lenient, if recreational then personally they should get shafted. As others have said, you suspend until the outcome, you know more than you’ve posted and you know the driver

liam_LL · Post by **liam_LL** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:43 pm

Suspended until full investigation carried out and the exact circumstances are fully known. As a few have said not enough detail provided to form a proper opinion.

LaLavendex · Post by **LaLavendex** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:43 pm

No no no why the hell would you let him drive anything instant dismissal ffs

Ricc.Infamous · Post by **Ricc.Infamous** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:44 pm

Are you serious?

515hayconvas · Post by **515hayconvas** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:44 pm

Suspend until court date

Muhlorlo · Post by **Muhlorlo** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:45 pm

Stop them driving unless taking a drug test before or each or more sensibly give them other non driving duties

Losraxx · Post by **Losraxx** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:45 pm

Doesn't say what drugs... stop jumping the gun people

Pauanze · Post by **Pauanze** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:46 pm

Just failing a roadside would be grounds to suspend for gross misconduct pending an inquiry, yoh can't finish that inquiry until the result of the criminal prosecution.
Suspension for gross misconduct is without pay, so suspend, investigate and deal with it when you know the final outcome in court.

Sullivate · Post by **Sullivate** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:46 pm

He can be sacked in accordance with your HR policy.
A positive test alone, even without a conviction, is enough to to dispense with their services for Gross misconduct.
Document your actions well and you'll have no issues in an employment tribunal.
Check out the ACAS website for guidance.

Kurisure · Post by **Kurisure** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:47 pm

Stop now you need to sack them and show that you are coving yourself as you will also end up with a PI I recon.

seaGo2 · Post by **seaGo2** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:47 pm

Take him off driving give him a broom till court case lol he may leave anyway

stephenJr · Post by **stephenJr** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:48 pm

Poorly worded (lack of information) ME/MINE:-If its prescribed and the driver has a valid prescription that states ok to drive while using and made me aware at point of employment, Anything else gross misconduct, instantly dismissed...As stated in the drivers Contract under "drugs"!

alexpa · Post by **alexpa** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:49 pm

Would you go to court for weed? Cocaine, heroin or something else quite sinister yes, I would have thought to.

STEiNTURE · Post by **STEiNTURE** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:49 pm

If you have a drug and alcohol policy, this should mention you cannot drive a company vehicle. Whilst you can do random checks, you can miss a driver, should we say "not adhering to the policy" If the driver is caught by the authorities, you need to be proactive and reduce the risk to the company. Suspend the driver on full pay, pending the outcome (expensive I know) if the driver is then cleared, return to work, if not dismiss or find work other than driving company vehicles, if he is a valued member and wish to keep him. This cover's HR obligations as well as covering the company's back. This is my opinion base on information given, there are many things to consider in various circumstances. The best thing for you to do is take all the evidence you have, ie policies, training etc. Present this to a legal body (HR) to give you a definitive answer...Good luck.

alexpa · Post by **alexpa** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:50 pm

Why is this even a question? Sacked. Drug driving is gross mis conduct.

benines · Post by **benines** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:50 pm

alexpa wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:50 pm Why is this even a question? Sacked. Drug driving is gross mis conduct.

and then if he’s found not guilty? OP needs to make sure he can afford a tribunal payout.

paulifly · Post by **paulifly** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:51 pm

alexpa wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:50 pm Why is this even a question? Sacked. Drug driving is gross mis conduct.

yeah right, sack someone without due process and pay millions in compensation later when guy will go to employment tribunal

alexpa · Post by **alexpa** » Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:52 pm

paulifly wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:51 pm
alexpa wrote: ↑Sun Mar 31, 2024 7:50 pm Why is this even a question? Sacked. Drug driving is gross mis conduct.
yeah right, sack someone without due process and pay millions in compensation later when guy will go to employment tribunal

both fair points. What about company drug and alcohol policy? Company should really have an outside contractor to do drugs or alcohol testing? Would

consult with a legal expert.