Can a driver with no LGV entitlement still train new employees? The role of insurance: Are there any concerns?

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AndryUrman
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Can a driver with no LGV entitlement still train new employees? The role of insurance: Are there any concerns?

Post by AndryUrman »

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In the transport industry, the role of a trainer is crucial for ensuring new drivers are well-prepared for their duties. However, a situation arises when a driver loses their LGV (Large Goods Vehicle) entitlement due to a medical issue, raising the question of whether they can still sit in the truck as a paid employee to advise and guide new drivers. Let's explore this situation, considering both the legal and practical aspects.

Legal considerations: What the law says

From a legal standpoint, there is no law that directly prohibits a driver without an LGV entitlement from acting as a trainer. The key factor here is that the driver who has lost their entitlement is not being asked to take over the vehicle or perform the duties of a licensed driver. Instead, their role would be limited to offering guidance based on their experience. As one forum participant pointed out, the individual has lost their vocational entitlement, but this does not negate their ability to train others or provide valuable advice.

Risk assessment: A critical step

Before proceeding with this arrangement, the company would need to conduct a full risk assessment. This process ensures that any potential hazards are identified and managed. Critical factors to consider include the driver’s medical condition, the risk of stress or fatigue, any ongoing medication, and the presence of underlying health conditions. It’s essential to evaluate whether the individual is fit for the role of guiding others while not actively driving.

The risk assessment also needs to take into account the situation if the new driver is unable to continue driving for any reason. One forum contributor suggested that a company could send another driver to take over in such cases, ensuring that the operation remains safe and compliant.

The role of insurance: Are there any concerns?

Insurance is another key consideration. Some companies may have policies that do not allow non-licensed individuals to ride in the truck. As highlighted by several forum members, this could be an issue if the company’s insurance policy specifies that only licensed drivers can be passengers. However, if this is the case, the company may need to adjust the policy to accommodate the situation or explore other solutions, such as having the trainer’s role classified differently.

The trainer’s responsibilities

It’s important to clarify that the individual who has lost their LGV entitlement would not be expected to take control of the vehicle. They would act as a trainer, offering advice on the job, routes, or procedures, but not on driving. This is a key distinction, as the trainer would still have valuable experience to share, but the onus for driving the vehicle rests solely with the new driver. In many cases, this type of arrangement is not uncommon; some companies send individuals without an HGV entitlement to act as a driver’s mate, guiding the driver without any expectation of taking over the vehicle.

Company policy and industry standards

Every company will have its own policy on training, and it’s not unusual for firms to insist that trainers must hold a current licence and all necessary qualifications. This was mentioned by one participant who expressed that, in their organisation, training can only be done by someone who holds the appropriate entitlement. However, other companies may take a more flexible approach, as long as the trainer's role is clearly defined and does not involve active driving.

In conclusion, while the situation may differ from company to company, there is generally no law preventing a former LGV driver from training new employees as long as they are not taking control of the vehicle. A full risk assessment and clear communication with the insurance provider are essential to ensure that all parties are covered. Ultimately, the trainer’s experience is invaluable, and with the right safeguards in place, this arrangement can work successfully, benefiting both the individual and the company.
Last edited by AndryUrman on Mon Feb 17, 2025 6:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
AndryUrman
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by AndryUrman »

If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal for him to sit as a paid employee in the truck to advise & learn new employees in their new job?
For avoidance of any doubt, the ‘new driver’ has passed their LGV test.
345ollearino
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by 345ollearino »

You need to consider risk assessing the modified duties, what is the condition?
AndryUrman
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by AndryUrman »

345ollearino wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:45 pm You need to consider risk assessing the modified duties, what is the condition?
TIA
Petelliamo
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by Petelliamo »

AndryUrman wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:46 pm
345ollearino wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:45 pm You need to consider risk assessing the modified duties, what is the condition?
TIA
full risk assessment needed.
345ollearino
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by 345ollearino »

AndryUrman wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:46 pm
345ollearino wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:45 pm You need to consider risk assessing the modified duties, what is the condition?
TIA
medication? Risk of stress / fatigue, underlying health conditions? Do you have occupational health?
Gouldfallen
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by Gouldfallen »

He has lost his vocational entitlement,not the ability to be a trainer.
Binnson
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by Binnson »

Gouldfallen wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:52 pm He has lost his vocational entitlement,not the ability to be a trainer.
or indeed the ability to speak. 🤷🏻‍♂️ too many people look straight for the negative. This will be good for the poor guys mental health, as he will feel he’s contributing his experience to others. I wish him luck.
Gouldfallen
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by Gouldfallen »

Binnson wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:52 pm
Gouldfallen wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:52 pm He has lost his vocational entitlement,not the ability to be a trainer.
or indeed the ability to speak. 🤷🏻‍♂️ too many people look straight for the negative. This will be good for the poor guys mental health, as he will feel he’s contributing his experience to others. I wish him luck.
well said
Binnson
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by Binnson »

None other than your insurance.
JamesLink
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by JamesLink »

From personal experience, No there is no law prohibiting it and is perfectly fine to do.
daveXcaptain
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by daveXcaptain »

If he's lost his entitlement he cannot take over therefore cannot sit in end of.
pligwort
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by pligwort »

daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:54 pm If he's lost his entitlement he cannot take over therefore cannot sit in end of.
The other person has a full licence.
daveXcaptain
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by daveXcaptain »

pligwort wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm
daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:54 pm If he's lost his entitlement he cannot take over therefore cannot sit in end of.
The other person has a full licence.
doesn't matter if he cannot continue for any reason then he would not be able to take over and the vehicle would have to be be abandoned, plus there is the question of insurance.
345ollearino
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by 345ollearino »

daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm
pligwort wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm
daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:54 pm If he's lost his entitlement he cannot take over therefore cannot sit in end of.
The other person has a full licence.
doesn't matter if he cannot continue for any reason then he would not be able to take over and the vehicle would have to be be abandoned, plus there is the question of insurance.
So you wouldn't send a trainer out if he didn't have a valid digi/CPC card or his HGV entitlement expired?
pligwort
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by pligwort »

daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm
pligwort wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm
daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:54 pm If he's lost his entitlement he cannot take over therefore cannot sit in end of.
The other person has a full licence.
doesn't matter if he cannot continue for any reason then he would not be able to take over and the vehicle would have to be be abandoned, plus there is the question of insurance.
He is being taught how to do the job, NOT how to drive.
daveXcaptain
Posts: 42
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by daveXcaptain »

345ollearino wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:56 pm
daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm
pligwort wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm

The other person has a full licence.
doesn't matter if he cannot continue for any reason then he would not be able to take over and the vehicle would have to be be abandoned, plus there is the question of insurance.
So you wouldn't send a trainer out if he didn't have a valid digi/CPC card or his HGV entitlement expired?
nope.
daveXcaptain
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by daveXcaptain »

pligwort wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:56 pm
daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm
pligwort wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm

The other person has a full licence.
doesn't matter if he cannot continue for any reason then he would not be able to take over and the vehicle would have to be be abandoned, plus there is the question of insurance.
He is being taught how to do the job, NOT how to drive.
still needs to be insured and capable of taking over.
AndryUrman
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by AndryUrman »

daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:57 pm
pligwort wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:56 pm
daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm

doesn't matter if he cannot continue for any reason then he would not be able to take over and the vehicle would have to be be abandoned, plus there is the question of insurance.
He is being taught how to do the job, NOT how to drive.
still needs to be insured and capable of taking over.
why does he need to be capable of taking over ?
The company can send out another driver from its base, as they would have done if he was on his own.
Peteines
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by Peteines »

daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:57 pm
pligwort wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:56 pm
daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm

doesn't matter if he cannot continue for any reason then he would not be able to take over and the vehicle would have to be be abandoned, plus there is the question of insurance.
He is being taught how to do the job, NOT how to drive.
still needs to be insured and capable of taking over.
no he doesn’t, he is there to guide the driver not take over.
I know of companies that send out people who don’t even hold a hgv entitlement to show driver where to go and what’s involved in the job, like a drivers mate.
benines
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by benines »

daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:57 pm
pligwort wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:56 pm
daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm

doesn't matter if he cannot continue for any reason then he would not be able to take over and the vehicle would have to be be abandoned, plus there is the question of insurance.
He is being taught how to do the job, NOT how to drive.
still needs to be insured and capable of taking over.
So in your view trucks can’t be single manned either, because if the driver cannot continue there’s nobody to take over and the truck would have to be abandoned? 😂😂
lucozy
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by lucozy »

daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:57 pm
pligwort wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:56 pm
daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm

doesn't matter if he cannot continue for any reason then he would not be able to take over and the vehicle would have to be be abandoned, plus there is the question of insurance.
He is being taught how to do the job, NOT how to drive.
still needs to be insured and capable of taking over.
So you send all trucks out with two drivers just in case? You’re making problems that don’t exist
Rickel.Mickle
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by Rickel.Mickle »

345ollearino wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:56 pm
daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm
pligwort wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm

The other person has a full licence.
doesn't matter if he cannot continue for any reason then he would not be able to take over and the vehicle would have to be be abandoned, plus there is the question of insurance.
So you wouldn't send a trainer out if he didn't have a valid digi/CPC card or his HGV entitlement expired?
absolutely not
345ollearino
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by 345ollearino »

Rickel.Mickle wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 6:00 pm
345ollearino wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:56 pm
daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm

doesn't matter if he cannot continue for any reason then he would not be able to take over and the vehicle would have to be be abandoned, plus there is the question of insurance.
So you wouldn't send a trainer out if he didn't have a valid digi/CPC card or his HGV entitlement expired?
absolutely not
what's the reason?
Rickel.Mickle
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by Rickel.Mickle »

pligwort wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:56 pm
daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm
pligwort wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm

The other person has a full licence.
doesn't matter if he cannot continue for any reason then he would not be able to take over and the vehicle would have to be be abandoned, plus there is the question of insurance.
He is being taught how to do the job, NOT how to drive.
I wouldn’t let a person train another if he didn’t have his full entitlement and it’s our company policy you can only train what you have the entitlement to train and hold all current license and qualifications to do so
vanLinkin
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by vanLinkin »

daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:57 pm
pligwort wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:56 pm
daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:55 pm

doesn't matter if he cannot continue for any reason then he would not be able to take over and the vehicle would have to be be abandoned, plus there is the question of insurance.
He is being taught how to do the job, NOT how to drive.
still needs to be insured and capable of taking over.
bull sh**
Huntic
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by Huntic »

daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:54 pm If he's lost his entitlement he cannot take over therefore cannot sit in end of.
what you say would only be true if you were planning to double man the vehicle, however the experienced driver that has lost his entitlement is acting as just a passenger or commonly called a drivers mate
simonixx
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by simonixx »

daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:54 pm If he's lost his entitlement he cannot take over therefore cannot sit in end of.
🤦‍♂️😂 very few drivers mates will have the licence entitlement. It doesn’t stop them from going out. Why would it stop a trainer going out?
daveXcaptain
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by daveXcaptain »

simonixx wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 6:03 pm
daveXcaptain wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 5:54 pm If he's lost his entitlement he cannot take over therefore cannot sit in end of.
🤦‍♂️😂 very few drivers mates will have the licence entitlement. It doesn’t stop them from going out. Why would it stop a trainer going out?
it's a different kettle altogether, if you've bever been a tm and you don't have the qualifications to be a tm you'll never know. I'm bored now as well somebody asked for advice and I gave it. I did not ask for all the keyboard warriors to start questioning that advice and I don't need it, so ffs move on.
Callumbi
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by Callumbi »

Perfectly legal, leave the lad alone he's clearly just trying to earn a living
AndryUrman
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by AndryUrman »

As the OP, I may add that the TIA hasn’t left any side effects.
Speech, vision, mobility all still in tact.
chrisen
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by chrisen »

Abslolutely fine he doesnt need to take over and cant due to having no licence, he is fine to pass on his experience and help a new or existing lgv licenced driver
becksp
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by becksp »

Only thing I see is if your insurance says no 'passengers' ..if it did it could be varied
pear9makl
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by pear9makl »

Can I say how refreshing it is to see a company looking to retain an employee rather than canning them to replace them when it wasn't their fault. Good on you sir.
gaspe-2356
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Re: If a driver loses his LGV entitlement due to a medical issue is there anything in law that would make it illegal

Post by gaspe-2356 »

pear9makl wrote: Mon Feb 17, 2025 6:06 pm Can I say how refreshing it is to see a company looking to retain an employee rather than canning them to replace them when it wasn't their fault. Good on you sir.
I agree mate, that's some actual company values right there
MiMurdyners
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Can a driver with no LGV entitlement still train new employees? The role of insurance: Are there any concerns?

Post by MiMurdyners »

The passenger is only passing on his vast experience and no risk assessment required. He is giving his advice where needed but ultimate decisions down to driver. I honestly don’t know what problem is.
Bluecorn
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Re: Can a driver with no LGV entitlement still train new employees? The role of insurance: Are there any concerns?

Post by Bluecorn »

So, what diverse answers.
The only risk assessment would be as a return to work of our trainer.
They’re not going to driver, so no need for a licence. The company that’s says the trainer needs full entitlement is simply limiting their opportunities.
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